[crowfield99]

Hi Guys,

Got a quick question for you all. We all know that 02, Orange & Three all need a USIM to take advantage of 3G on the network. But on the other hand - Vodafone & T-Mobile dont. They both use Normal 2G SIM Cards to get onto the 3G Networks.

My question being is why do you need the USIMS then? Wouldn't it make life easier just to use the standard 2G SIM Cards for 3G? Why do networks use the USIMS? What do they do that a 2G SIM cant?

Reason why i am posting this is I bought the Moto C975 while it was on Offer on Orange, came with the USIM and all set up. But then I decided to upgrade from Pay As You go To Contract so the USIM of course becomes inactive. I wanted to give this phone to my mother so she could use Video Calling, of course you need a USIM! Contact Orange, Sorry we dont sell USIMs like we do for 2G at the moment.

You would think if they were going to use USIMS over standard 2G ones that they would have prepared a bit more in advance!

The good news is somehow I found a USIM for Orange off eBay. Cost me £15 also but it was the only way.

Anyone shine any light on this?

[Ben]

The USIM will ultimately replace the SIM cards we currently use. Some operators have embraced 3G as an opportunity to switch to USIM cards, also using the two different SIM formats to keep a tight grip on their 3G vs 2G userbase.

The USIM's benefits:
Increased storage capacity (128 kilobytes of storage vs 32 kilobytes).
More reliable for 3G international roaming (other networks may not provide full support for 3G on a standard 2G SIM).
Better security
Extra fields on the address book (for example e-mail addresses).

I think it has to be said that T-Mobile and Vodafone's current approach to the situation is much more favourable to consumers than Three, O2 and Orange's. But are Vodafone and T-Mobile missing a trick by not migrating their customers to USIM?

[crowfield99]

I see what the USIM does now, I dont have a problem with using a USIM but as you can guess if your USIM on Orange gets lost or you are giving it away and the old USIM becomes inactive its more than a pain to get a replacement!

Think its the same with 02 isn't it? Only get them in a box with a new phone!

With you saying 128 kb, I visit Cyprus for my holidays every year and use Cytamobile-Vodafone. They dont have 3G Just yet, but started to upgrade to 128kb compat. SIM Cards. Does that mean these might be used for 3G also? If so, exciting! :D

[Ben]

I guess so, yes, but GSMWorld doesn't suggest they have a 3G network planned at the moment. Is there any visual distinction on a SIM/USIM do you know? It's quite possible that networks like Vodafone and T-Mobile have deployed USIM's for some or all new SIM cards but have just chosen not to make access an issue like the others.

At the end of the day the SIM/USIM is just an ID card, granting your access to the network. Whether you're provisioned for 3G or not is down to the operator's computer system. At a complete guess I'd imagine Orange, Three and O2 require the new type of security in order for access to the 3G network to be granted, where as T-Mobile and Vodafone just require the current level offered by SIM.

Edit: On the subject of Cyprus... OH MY GOD! http://www.areeba.com.cy/Sub.aspx?ID=267&MID=153&FirstParentID=151

[solo12002]

So whats the problem with networks permitting ppl to buy USIM sim cards?

I would of thought there are a number of older 3g mobiles out there that could be used by ppl thus inproving the uptake of 3G.

Why force ppl to buy a mobile in order to have access to 3G the same can be said for O2.

[Ben]

3G adds another level of complexity to the ways of old. By only selling 3G phones with enabled USIM's the networks are guaranteeing the user experience, and have the highest chance of getting a higher return on their 3G investment which is what they need to be showing in their accounts right now.

At least not all the operators took this decision.

[etccarmageddon]

you dont need to spend £15 or whatever on ebay to get an orange pay as you go usim. your local orange shop will be happy to supply one for £5 - as I have managed to do this.

[crowfield99]

Nearest Orange Shop = 15+ Miles since they closed the nearest that was about 5 miles away late in 2004. Its daft, I could not get one over the phone at all!

If they sold them in Carphone Warehouse that would have cut the trip down to 10 miles. Its good when people have them things called Cars, but I dont!

Regarding my Cytamobile-Vodafone Sim it just says 128kb on the front of it. Thats about it and Soeasy Pay As You Go And the Vodafone logo.

Areebia is like 3 in the UK. Very new network, coverage is naff unless you live in the city (where I go on Holiday nill - so useless) but does not have 02 to fall back on! Oh well, sure they will cover the whole of Cyprus before 3 can cover the UK!

[etccarmageddon]

you should be able to ring orange customer services and order one to be posted to you - other people have.

[crowfield99]

Tell me how you do that please, I would like a spare! All I get when I ring is "We Don't sell them yet, only included in the box with new 3G phones."

Anyways, how thick am I? I decided to take my Cytamobile-Vodafone SIM Card out and looked on the back and it says USIM, 2G, 3G, 128k on the back. Doh! :D

[k8elou]

Wonder if you can help as I think I am being thick here!! I get the difference between the normal 2G sim and 3G sim now thanks for explanation above but ... does that mean you cant use a normal 2G sim in a 3G phone even if you are not bothered about using video calling or loads of downloads etc? I really want a 6280 but i only want to do it on a contract for a year and then cancel and put my old sim card in that 3g phone. i am currently on 02 and want to get the 6280 on 02 too when it comes out in march. my current 02 contract is so good (i.e. 550 mins, 500 texts and 500 gprs mins for £15) so i dont really want to cancel it but keep it going. if i ask 02 about upgrading instead to get the 6280 i doubt they are gonna come up with anything comparable ... unless its about 35 per month which i really cant afford to do forever! any ideas gratefully received, desp for 6280 cos i like the look of it but really not bothered about the 3g aspect which is a bummer! looked at 6270 but quite a bit more bulky that 6280, sorry waffling on now !!! k8elou

[Ben]

Hey :)

Welcome to Talk3G!

An O2 SIM card will work fine in a 3G phone, or at least it should, but you wont be able to access 3G services unless you can get O2 to send you a USIM as a replacement. It's not out of the question, so try asking them.

You should check with O2 to make sure they definitely wont let you upgrade but stay on the same tariff. Sure, they might want you to pay towards the handset, but I shouldn't imagine it'd be more than having to pay for a 12 month contract you don't even want.

You could even consider buying SIM Free - it might work out cheaper than having to get that extra contract: http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/product/9408.htm

I had no idea the 6270 was bigger and heavier! Who knew! A 3G phone smaller than it's 2G counterpart, wow ;)

[Hands0n]

My good lady, who is on O2 and a tariff she is quite happy with, is in the process of changing to 3G with O2 (a Sony Ericsson K700i). There has absolutely no problem getting the new handset (foc) and continuing the contract, the only stipulation is that the contract is now to run for a further minimum of 12 months.

I reckon that you will find that when the 6280 comes out on O2 you will have the opportunity to upgrade to it, even going to 3G at the same time and so not losing out on the benefits there. All the time retaining your existing contract features, but making an obligation to stay with O2 for a fruther 12 or 18 months (it will probably be the latter, they tried to get her to do that for the Samsung Z320i she first wanted). So long as you're happy with that then the 6280 is yours :D

Don't forget, once you have the 3G handset and USIM you are able to flip back to 2G in areas where there is no 3G coverage - at home or abroad. There is really no need to be swapping the 3G USIM for the old 2G SIM. In fact, O2 will move all your details to the USIM when you get it so the 2G SIM will become defunct.